While Joe Biden faces increasing criticism for domestic policies, his foreign agenda remains strong. Can the twain meet?
In the 5 months since Russia’s invasion, the American public’s attention has turned back to problems at home — and US President Joe Biden hasn’t gotten a good grade for his handling of them. But last week, he was able to lead major policy breakthroughs at the NATO and G7 summits.
Today, can President Biden’s push to spread democracy abroad help him deal with various crises back home? Read the full transcript here.
Host: Gustavo Arellano
Guests: L.A. Times White House reporter Eli Stokols
More reading:
Biden commits to more U.S. forces in Europe as NATO invites Sweden and Finland to join
Implored by Zelensky, Biden and G-7 allies will increase Ukraine defense aid, economic support
Gustavo: This year's back-to-back G7 and NATO summits were more than a parade of // endless meetings.
<
For one, the NATO meeting ended with Finland and Sweden just steps away from being new members.
AP: 30 NATO allies have signed off on the accession protocols for Sweden and Finland.
Gustavo: NATO members also presented a united front against Russia’s assault on Ukraine.
Biden: Transatlantic unity has been and will continue to be the greatest strength in our response to Russia.
Gustavo: But in the 5 months since Russia’s invasion…the American public’s attention has turned back to problems at home….and US President Joe Biden hasn’t gotten a good grade for his handling of them.
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Gustavo: I’m Gustavo Arellano. You’re listening to THE TIMES, daily news from the LA Times.
It’s Friday, July 8th, 2022.
Today, can President Biden’s push to spread democracy abroad help him deal with various crises back home?
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Gustavo: LA Times White House reporter Eli Stokols recently accompanied Biden on his tour of Europe. Eli, welcome to the times.
Eli Stokols: Hey, thanks for having me.
Gustavo: So NATO, just to remind folks, was set up decades ago to counter the threat of the Soviet Union and leaders just wrapped up their summit last week in Madrid, while most folks in the US were thinking of, uh, other things. What was the mood like over there at NATO?
Eli Stokols: It was a busy week and a historic summit, and they are dealing with an ongoing war in Ukraine. I mean, these are very consequential summits back to back.
Eli Tape: The right honorable Boris Johnson, prime minister of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
Eli Stokols: But there was an awareness also that for all the good feeling among the leaders who were there…
Eli Tape: Her excellency… Fredrickson prime minister of the kingdom of Denmark,
Eli Stokols: But they were all dealing with really difficult situations, domesticly. Maybe no one more so than president Biden.
Eli Tape: Joe Biden, president of the United States of America.
Eli Stokols: You just couldn't avoid the awareness that all this was happening against the backdrop of real domestic upheaval with the row ruling inflation, continuing just so much going on at home. You know, not that it's not important that the west is trying to figure out how to stay United and how to continue to support Ukraine in a war that does not look to have any end in sight at this point.
Eli Tape: So fun. Wasn't it? Don't you love those leader photos? I just love it. So dynamic. I love them. I know.
Eli Stokols: You know, you have a lot of time when you're waiting to go into some of these rooms where the leaders are, or when you're just gathering in the press file and killing time, eating bad sandwiches out of a cooler, you have time to interact with other members of the press from other countries. And that was a lot of the conversation. What is it like over there? How bad is it, how hard has it been for Biden?
Tape: Thank you guys. Smart guys. Let's go around.
Eli Stokols: Those are the questions that folks have. I mean, there's an awareness that he's stuck around 40% with his approval rating.
Gustavo: You did mention Russia earlier and Ukraine. And that obviously was one of the big items for the summit. And actually it led to a new strategic concept to outline NATO's objectives in the next decade. What does that entail?
Eli Stokols: Right. This had not been updated in 12 years and you know, if you step back.
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Eli Stokols: The first NATO summit I covered was in 2018 in Brussels. When Donald Trump was there and threatening to pull out of the Alliance altogether…
AP: He spent days arguing some members are freeloading off the us by not spending enough on defense with the shuck and are paid for the whole thing, calling it unacceptable.
Eli Stokols: And it was a really chaotic summit. And to contrast this, which yes, it's taking place with war, a ground war in Europe, for the first time in decades, really, since NATO's founding. The sense of cohesion among the leaders of NATO and the G7
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Eli Stokols: was just so different from what we saw a few years ago. This war has brought the Alliance back together, given it new life, new purpose, and you saw at the NATO summit, really the organization leveraging the war in a way to strengthen the Alliance itself.
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Eli Stokols: And the strategic concept, what it says, is that they're going to beef up NATO's troop presence in the Eastern flank, the Eastern part of the Alliance, close to Russia.
AP: President Biden says America's military presence in Europe is about to get bigger.
Biden: in Poland. We're gonna establish a permanent headquarters, the US Fifth army corps. And, uh, strengthening our US NATO interoperability across the entire Eastern plank. AP: The president says he's also boosting rotational troop deployments to Romania and the Baltics, sending more fighter jet squadrons to the UK, more air defenses and other capabilities to Germany and Italy.
Eli Stokols: And you have allies committing to actually increase their defense spending.The thing that president Trump was berating them and telling them they had to do. This is just a total sea change. And the security architecture of Europe and the entire transatlantic. Overall through NATO in terms of high readiness troops. They're gonna go from about 40,000 to, within a year, around 300,000. It's just so much different. And then you also, at this summit had Finland and Sweden officially being invited to join the Alliance. These are two countries. Finland has an 800-mile border with Russia. They have been strategically neutral throughout the cold war and afterwards.
Gustavo: And all these moves push the Alliance to that brink of confrontation with Russia. How risky is all of this and how is Russian president Vladimir Putin responding?
Eli Stokols: Well, so Putin, uh, is very aware of all of this and really sent a message.
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Eli Stokols: When the G7 opened, he stepped up attacks on Kyiv, the Ukrainian capital, which had kind of seen the fighting go elsewhere over the last month or two.
AP: Russian missiles have shattered weeks of relative calm in Ukraine's capital.
Eli Stokols: There were attacks on civilian buildings, you know, apartment buildings in Kiev.
AP: with Western leaders, meeting in Europe, bearing to reaffirm their support for Ukraine and condemnation of Russia.
Eli Stokols: The next day, there was a brutal missile attack on a very crowded shopping mall in the middle of Ukraine killing a lot of people.
AP: Long-range bombers struck the shopping mall in the afternoon with more than 1000 people inside.
Eli Stokols: These are really horrible messages that Vladamir Putin is sending to the West saying, I see you all gathering together and vowing to resolve. Well, I'm here and I'm not going anywhere. And you know, this war is by no means settled.The end is still sort of murky.
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Gustavo: Coming up after the break…how the Group of 7 is taking on Russia….and China.
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Gustavo: Eli, during his trip to Europe, President Biden also attended the G7 summit in Germany….And just a reminder, the membership for this includes 7 of the world’s most advanced economies. There, they outlined more defense aid for Ukraine…What else did they accomplish?
Eli Stokols: There are a couple other things that are interesting, although they're not fully cooked. One is a proposal or sort of a, a loose agreement to task the finance ministers of these countries to perhaps go ahead and set a price cap on Russian oil exports to cap the price so that when Russia continues to sell its oil around the world and fund this war that they're not able to take in quite as much money. It's a novel concept. It's not really clear if every country will go along with that, but that would be a really extraordinary step if that comes to pass. And the other thing is this infrastructure bank.
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Eli Stokols: A year ago at Cornwall at the last G7, President Biden's first, the leaders outlined this plan to invest a lot of money // to set up a bank, basically where the developing world smaller countries could go to get financing for infrastructure projects. Because up until this point, when countries have needed that kind of money, China has been the one providing it through the belt and road initiative. The G7 is really intent on lessening China's influence around the world on giving, developing countries, uh, loan options that do not come with strings attached.
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Eli Stokols: Nothing really happened over the last year. Now they are outlining a plan to spend a lot of money, 600 billion, about a third of which will come from the United States.
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Eli Stokols: That really is the biggest component out of the G7. When it comes to trying to address China's growing influence and to have a more muscular alternative coming from the G7in the west.
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Gustavo: China also came up during the NATO summit. Here’s the alliance’s Secretary General Jens <
AP: It'll address China for the first time and the challenges that Beijing poses to our security, interests and values.
Gustavo: What are these challenges that he mentions?
Eli Stokols: The NATO strategic concept for the first time mentioned China and it linked Russia in China as allies, uh, as partners in this broader conflict for and against democracy, for principles of freedom. That's pretty interesting that NATO, which is, you know, again, 30 going on 32 countries feels the need to mention China. This is a transatlantic Alliance, historically, this is not really given much thought to what's going on in the Pacific. The more that the Alliance is unified, the more that Europe pulls its own weight in its own, uh, security and defense. I think that is something that is pretty significant and will be seen in Beijing. Because now the US may be a little freer to deal with China, uh, since it's not propping up NATO and European security all on its own.
Gustavo: Yeah. How, how did, uh, Chinese officials respond?
Eli Stokols: I mean, they didn't like it, you know, is basically… they don't like being called out.
AP: China has reprimanded NATO for what it calls the alliances cold war mentality, a Chinese foreign ministry spokesman also said NATO should give up the practice of creating enemies.
Eli Stokols: The fact that a lot of US allies from the region from the Indo-Pacific showed up at this NATO summit, Australia, New Zealand. India, Japan, these are not NATO members. The Chinese can say whatever they want, but they can see the other powers in their region aligning more closely with the west. And that is significant. If the G7 gets its act together with the infrastructure bank, if there is ultimately a resolution in Europe where the war ends, Ukraine survives, the west holds; that's gonna be pretty meaningful. Because the message will have been sent not just to Russia, but to Beijing as well.
Gustavo: Yeah, again, all of this is happening. All these big geopolitical international issues are happening and Biden is being good at this, but you reported that world leaders at both the G7 and NATO summits were sharing concern, even pity for the state of democracy back in the United States.
Eli Stokols: The United States is such a powerful symbol to its allies and so many people around the world that to see just before the G seven began to see that ruling from the Supreme Court, taking away the federal protections for abortion. There were a lot of leaders that just were very vocal about how dispiriting that was. You know, as much as they say, oh, Biden still has our confidence. They can read the same polls that we all can. And when 85% of Americans say that the country's on the wrong track, that's concerning, that's concerning for people in other foreign capitals who wanna work with the United States, but who are trying to figure out, well, how much money do we really invest in this infrastructure bank? Will this be around in three years, right? Will this continue to be in an initiative that the US supports? If elections go a different way and Joe Biden's no longer the president. And so it's complicated for a lot of these other leaders for American, all. To sort of figure out how much skin to put in the game.
Biden: Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you,
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Eli Stokols: President Biden's final press conference in Madrid, I'd say about half the questions were about domestic issues about abortion.
Biden: I can understand why the American people are frustrated because of what the Supreme court did. I can understand why the American people are frustrated because of inflation…
Eli Stokols: And I just think there's no escaping that. And that continues to be the focus at home. Uh, and everybody's aware of.
Biden: We're better positioned to deal with this than anyone, but we have a way to go. And the Supreme court, we have to change that decision by codifying Roe V. Wade
Gustavo: Coming up after the break can Biden's international push boost Democrats chances in the midterms because right now it's not looking good.
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Gustavo: Eli… there's been general support for, uh, Biden's policy on Ukraine, but a lot of that hasn't translated into a better approval numbers back home.
Eli Stokols: That's true. And this is a White House. That's just been sort of stuck for several months and they're not really sure what to do about it, honestly. And, and you can kind of see that there's no answer. They know that inflation and the rising cost of gas and other consumer goods is really hurting them. And that is largely a consequence of the war. They have tried to explain that they have tried to say again and again, look, this is Putin's price hike. But you know, I think that after months of this not being able to move the numbers, that people don't want an explanation, they just want the gas prices to come down.They don't care whether it's Biden's fault or not Biden's fault. Biden's the president, they're paying more. They're frustrated.
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Eli Stokols: There was a very interesting question at the press conference that the president did just before flying home from Madrid last week, when he was asked…
AP: how long is it fair to expect American drivers and drivers around the world to pay that premium for this war?
Eli Stokols: Should Americans be willing to indefinitely pay this much? For gas, as long as Ukraine continues to need to fight this war. And he said, yes, he said, yes,
Biden: as long as it takes. So Russia cannot in fact, defeat Ukraine and move beyond Ukraine.
Eli Stokols: And so that was a very blunt and honest response. That's the white house's thinking on this, but the person who's enduring political pain here is president Biden.
It's Democrats.
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Gustavo: So how then does Biden sell what he’s doing on the foreign stage…even if people support him for it….when they’re more concerned about the problems right in front of them and there doesn’t seem to be any solution in sight.
Eli Stokols: Yeah. I don't know that there is. I mean, he has gone out and given a whole lot of speeches. He has played with the language. He has stood in the port of Los Angeles. He has talked about supply chain issues. He has tried to explain why costs are high. He has tried to put the pressure on oil and gas companies to produce more. He has railed against some of these shipping conglomerates that he says are, are price-gouging. He has tried to put the onus in part on the private sector while also explaining, look, this is just a consequence of this struggle for democracy in Europe. It's just not clear that that's going to really work politically in the short term.This is a long term commitment in Ukraine, the elections in America, and most elections in other countries, these are short term calculations that voters are making. How am I doing right now? And, and when the answer is // I'm paying more, I'm frustrated, you know, a lot of times voters seek a change.
Gustavo: Finally Eli….Biden hasn’t been afraid to go big and be bold on the world stage….why can’t he muster the same sort of assertiveness for solutions here at home?
Eli Stokols: Well, I think those who are more sympathetic to the president and the stress of the job and the limitations of the job will tell you correctly that presidents have always had more latitude and foreign policy; There's just fewer constraints, fewer checks on his power than there are in passing domestic policy, where you have the Congress that a lot of the stuff needs to go through. And then you have the courts that can always nullify, legislation and change things afterwards. That's fair. That's true.
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Eli Stokols: But Biden is an institutionalist right at his core. He talks about it. It's it's pretty clear. He sees NATO as an institution right now that needs shoring up. New strategic concept. New members coming in Finland and Sweden in his closing press conference. He said that this summit was a response to the world, as it is now.
Biden: This summit was about strengthening our alliance, meeting the challenges of our world as it is today. And the threats we're gonna face in the future.
Eli Stokols: That's why they're making these moves. That's why they're updating this strategic concept. Putting more troops in Europe, committing billions of dollars to Ukraine in defense aid. And I think whether it's fair or not the way it presents is a lot of conviction and certainty and action in foreign affairs juxtaposed with a president who, with all the chaos in the United States, the Supreme court and the Senate, and all these counter majoritarian institutions in our own democracy, making our democracy really less and less representative giving the minority more and more power. This is a president who has not expressed any support for making any structural changes to stabilize American democracy.
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Eli Stokols: You know, there is some frustration that you're starting to hear more and more from within the democratic party and the democratic base that this just isn't is a president. who's telling you what he's not willing to do, but does not seem to project or convey the same frustration and outrage that the base feels in seeing abortion rights rolled back..
Eli Stokols: And seeing this Supreme court veering off in a more activist, conservative direction.
Eli Stokols: People wanna see more fight from this president on the left and more resolve more conviction. That's not to this point who this president has been. He's been trying to be more unifying in the way he talks about things, trying to talk about bipartisan solutions and in some ways to a lot of people seems increasingly sort of out-of-step with this moment that he finds himself in.
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Biden: All right guys. I'm no, there's no such thing as a quick win. I'm outta here. Thank you all very much.
Gustavo: Eli. Thank you so much for this conversation.
Eli Stokols: Thank you. I've enjoyed it.
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Gustavo: And that's it for this episode at the times, daily news from the LA times, Denise Garra, Kaha bra, and Syria, Henry were the HEAs on this episode. And Mike Heflin mixed and master day. Our show produced by Shannon Lynn, Denise Garra, Kaha, bra David dot, and Ashley Brown. Our editorial assistants are Madeline Amma and Carlos Erra.
Our intern is sir Henry. Our engineers are Mario Diaz, mark Netto and Mike Catholic. Our editor is Kinzie Morlan. Our executive producers are has, and Shawn Hilton and our theme music is by. Like what you're listening to then make sure to follow the times on whatever platform you use. I'm gusta. We'll be back next week with all the news in this.
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OLD SCRIPT BELOW
Intro mux or cold open tape
This year's back to back G7 and NATO summits were more than a parade of endless meetings.
<
For one, the NATO meeting ended with Finland and Sweden as new members.
<
NATO members also presented a united front against Russia’s assault on Ukraine.
CLIP CALLED: “AP_BIDEN UNITY”
The transatlantic community has been and will continue to be the greatest strength in our response to Russia, transatlantic security. We're standing as one to support Ukraine and to enhance our own deterrence and defense capabilities.
But in the 5 months since Russia’s invasion…the American public’s attention has turned back to problems at home….and US President Joe Biden hasn’t gotten a good grade for his handling of them.
<
I’m Gustavo Arellano. You’re listening to THE TIMES, daily news from the LA Times.
It’s Friday, July 8th, 2022.
Today, can President Biden’s push to spread democracy abroad help him deal with various crises back home?
Mux bump to fade out
Gustavo: LA Times White House reporter Eli Stokols recently accompanied Biden on his tour of Europe. Eli, welcome to the Times.
Eli: Thx
Gustavo: Eli, so NATO, just to remind folks, was set up decades ago to counter the threat of the Soviet Union. Leaders just wrapped up their summit last week in Madrid, while most folks in the US were thinking of, um, other things. What was the mood like over there at
Eli: Gives opinion
<
Gustavo: So the big international issue in Europe this year has been Russia — not just its invasion of Ukraine, but its threats to other NATO members. That was one of the big items for the summit, and a new strategic concept came out to outline NATO’s objectives in the next decade. What does that entail?
Eli:
Gustavo: Yeah, here’s UK prime minister Boris Johnson talking about unified support for Ukraine.
CLIP CALLED: “Boris Johnson Unity”
I think one of the things we've seen in this G seven, uh, today is a really, really powerful sense of, of unity and resolve and purpose and, uh, uh, absolute determination to keep giving, uh, the Ukrainians, the, the help, the support, the wherewithal, uh, to keep going.
Gustavo: These moves push the alliance to the brink of confrontation with Russia. Just how risky is all this, and how is Russian President Vladimir Putin responding?
Eli:
Gustavo: Coming up after the break…how the Group of 7 is taking on Russia….and China.
Gustavo: Eli…during his trip to Europe…President Biden also attended the G-7 summit in Germany….And just a reminder, the membership for this includes 7 of the world’s most advanced economies. There, they outlined more defense aid for Ukraine…What else did they accomplish?
Eli: There are a couple other things that are interesting….
Gustavo: Yeah…China also came up during the NATO summit. Here’s the alliance’s Secretary General Jens <
It'll address China for the first time and the challenges that Beijing poses to our security, interests and values.
Gustavo: Coming up after the break…Can Biden’s international priorities boost Democrats’ chances in the midterms? Because right now, it’s not looking so good…
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Gustavo: Eli, what do polls show about how Americans feel when it comes to President Biden’s handling of the war in Ukraine?
Eli:
Gustavo: That hasn’t really helped his approval numbers back home, though….
Eli: Nope, they recently hit 39%...and haven’t been over 50% in months
Gustavo: And a lot of that is thanks to some very real problems …like soaring inflation, supply chain issues, the pandemic and more…to what extent is the Biden administration to blame for these problems?
Eli:
Gustavo: So how then does Biden sell what he’s doing on the foreign stage…even if people support him for it….when they’re more concerned about the problems right in front of them and there doesn’t seem to be any solution in sight.
Eli: Yeah…I don’t think that there is….
“This isn’t aid or charity,” he said. “It’s an investment that will deliver returns for everyone, including the American people.” Short-term challenges like higher prices for consumers “will not divert us away from our affirmative agenda to show the world that democracies, when they work together, provide the single best path to deliver results for our people and people all over the world.”
that new strategic concept:
CLIP CALLED: “AP NATO CHINA”
It'll address China for the first time and the challenges that Beijing poses to our security, interests and values.
What are these challenges he mentions?
Eli: offering developing countries financing alternatives to China’s $4-trillion Belt and Road Initiative, which has been criticized for increasing corruption and violating labor, environmental and other standards.
Gustavo follow up (if you want!): How did leaders in Beijing respond to being mentioned in the strategic concept?
Eli: not happy
AP CLIP: China has reprimanded NATO for what it calls the alliances called war mentality. A Chinese foreign ministry spokesman also said NATO should give up the practice of creating enemies and not to try to mess up Asia and the whole world. After disrupting Europe,
Gustavo: President Biden came into office saying that China was going to be one of his top priorities…but domestic issues have distracted him mightily from this. You reported that world leaders at the G7 and NATO summits shared concern… even pity for the state of democracy in the United States?
Eli:
Gustavo: And now… Biden’s next stop on his world tour is Saudi Arabia. What does he hope to accomplish there?
Eli:
Gustavo: Finally Eli….one thing that’s been really clear in our conversation here, but also in the months since the invasion of Ukraine…is that Biden hasn’t been afraid to go big and be bold on the world stage….why can’t he muster the same sort of assertive solutions here at home?
Eli:
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Gustavo: Eli, thank you so much for this conversation.
Eli: Thanks so much for having me.
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Gustavo: And that’s it for this episode of THE TIMES, daily news from the LA Times.
Denise Guerra, Kasia Broussalian, and Surya Hendry were the jefas on this episode and Mike Heflin mixed and mastered it.
Our show is produced by Shannon Lin, Denise Guerra, Kasia Brousalian, David Toledo and Ashlea Brown. Our editorial assistants are Madalyn Amato and Carlos De Loera. Our intern is Surya Hendry. Our engineers are Mario Diaz, Mark Nieto and Mike Heflin. Our editor is Kinsee Morlan. Our executive producers are Jazmin Aguilera and Shani Hilton. And our theme music is by Andrew Eapen.
I'm Gustavo Arellano. We'll be back next week with all the news and desmadre. Gracias.
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